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I want to measure a shul's mechitzah but I'm not sure if the staff will mind

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A Modern Orthodox synagogue near me has a women's section. It's on a raised floor, raised a few inches above the men's section. From this raised floor rises a wooden partition (mechitza). Above the wooden partition rise some glass panels.

I want to measure the height of the raised floor, the partition, and the glass panels. I want to bring these measurements to my rabbi (a black-hatter) and see if he thinks the partition is a kosher one.

The synagogue is locked during the day: you have to ring the doorbell and have a staff member let you in.

Do you think the synagogue staff would mind me measuring the partition? If you think they'd mind, do you think it's permissible for me to measure the partition anyway?

Any other thoughts or suggestions?

Please also mention whether your reply is based on sources or your own logic.


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1   I like a person who gets into trouble :) - DannySep 13  '12 at 21:07
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1 answer!

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The issurim that I can think of in regards to another persons property are

  1. Gezel - Stealing
  2. Hezek - Damage
  3. Hanaah - Benefiting
  4. Tresspassing

There is no enjoyable benefit to you in this case so Hanaah does not apply.

There is no damage in this case so Hezek does not apply.

To transgress the issur of Gezel, one has to actually take hold of something and to an action that owners normally do, like Hagbaah (lifting) or Meshicha (pulling). Here you are not even touching it, and even if you are, I dont see why touching should be Ossur even if the owner forbids it. It is not Gezel.

The question that remains is whether there is a prohibition of tresspassing at all in Jewish Law. Possibly there is no Issur to go into someone elses property provided you take nothing and do not damage. This I do not know (I am trying to find a source for this).

But even if there is, the owners in this case would let you in do daven so you are allowed in their property. If the owners tell you get out then the Issur of tresspassing would apply. But since they do not know that is why you are there, they let you in. Even if had they known they would never have let you in, that is irrelevant because Devarim Shebalev Enam Devarim (thoughts in the heart dont count). [It also might have to do with the sugya of Yiush when the owner doesnt know he has lost it. The halacha is that it is not called a Yiush because at the moment he does not yet know].

Based on the above I say GO FOR IT.

(Perhaps it is anyway fine so to Mafrish them from an Averah, but who said they will listen :-) )


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    To find out more about tresspassing it is worth checking up about walking to your field through someone elses - DannySep 13  '12 at 21:08
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